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Boundless Body Radio
Treating Chronic Diseases with Ketogenic Diets: Insights from Temple Stewart, RD! 528
Ever grappled with the frustrations of weight loss, felt like an imposter when unable to make lifestyle changes, or tried to navigate the tempting world of delicious food while maintaining a healthy lifestyle? Join us, as we sit down with a trailblazer in the world of nutrition and health behavior change, Temple Stewart. With personal battles against Hashimoto's and PCOS, Temple has amassed a wealth of knowledge from her journey, and she's here to share it all with you.
We kick off by delving into her personal journey that led to the discovery of the transformative power of nutrition, shedding light on her transition to a low carb and ketogenic lifestyle. We then explore Temple's revolutionary work with veterans and how a low-carb diet had spectacular results, convincing her of the potential of ketosis to treat chronic diseases. We also discuss some of the typical misconceptions around the ketogenic diet, and you'll be surprised to hear some of the truths.
Finally, we bring to the forefront discussions on the impact of our food choices on our overall health. We consider the influence of carbohydrates, and Temple offers her insights on how to navigate the food landscape while maintaining a healthy lifestyle. Temple also shares her thoughts on natural medicine's role in healthcare and how she plans to integrate it into her practice. Trust me, you don't want to miss this empowering conversation that will leave you inspired to take control of your health by making intentional food choices and adopting a strategic lifestyle.
Find Temple at-
https://www.templetheketonutritionist.com/
IG- @the.ketogenic.nutritionist
FB- @templestewartrdn
YT- @The.Ketogenic.Nutritionist
Podcast- The Ketogenic Nutritionist with Temple Stewart, Registered Dietician
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Hello and welcome to another episode of Balanced Body Radio. I'm your host, casey Ruff, and today we have another amazing guest introduced to you. Now. Temple Stewart is a registered dietitian, certified personal trainer and health behavior change specialist. Temple played D1 soccer at the University of Tennessee Martin, where she earned her degree in dietetics. Her internship was completed at the VA Medical Center in Bay Pines, florida.
Speaker 1:The decision to become a registered dietitian stemmed from Temple's lifelong involvement in sports and her fascination with how proper fueling of the body affects performance. However, during her college years, she developed an unhealthy relationship with food, using food rules and diets as punishment or for comfort. This experience led her to delve into learning about food and its impact on the body, ultimately leading her to choose a career as a registered dietitian. Her interest in nutrition deepened after being diagnosed with Hashimoto's and PCOS, further emphasizing the importance of treating the body with proper nutrition. In her free time, if she has any, temple enjoys reading and working out and loves outdoor activities such as hiking, swimming, biking and exploring. Currently, temple resides in Gilbert, arizona, with her husband, two children and two poodles. Temple Stewart, what an episode honored is to welcome you to Balanced Body Radio.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm honored to be here. This is going to be a fun conversation.
Speaker 1:It's going to be a great conversation. I was telling you off air it's interesting to interview people like you because you've got such a wide range of topics and seemingly such a narrow ban, like when we're talking about, you know, ketosis, ketogenesis, like we're only talking about one thing, but there's so many aspects that we could go into, so I think this would be a really fun conversation. Yeah, yeah, it's going to be great and, as I said in the introduction, in your free time you like to do things. Do you have any free time?
Speaker 2:I do, I do. I make free time mostly because I have young kids that I think deserve a fun mom. So I do make free time, but I really, you know, I really love what I do and I'm really passionate about what I do and I think there's just so many people that need help so I don't consider my work work and so it just kind of all mushes together. But, yes, I do, I love Arizona, I love getting outdoors here. This is a fantastic place to live, for hiking and get out in the sun, and so, yeah, it's great. But you know, I don't consider my work, work at the same time. So I feel very blessed and honored to live the life I live. I really do.
Speaker 1:Isn't it amazing to bounce out of bed and just know that you've got information that can totally change the trajectory of somebody's life?
Speaker 2:It is fun. I will say that it is fun. It's been an honor, for sure.
Speaker 1:It's amazing yeah you do such great work too. I used an older version of your bio, so I got to the very end and talked about your two poodles. Do you still have your two poodles?
Speaker 2:I do. But you know what, when you were saying that we lost the oldest poodle, we lost from that bio, we got another dog, because we're dog people, and the dog that we adopted and they, from the place that we got them, they give their proceeds to adoption, which is a part of my family's story and all that. Anyway, he's mixed between a poodle and a Saint Bernard. So he's this massive 145, 50 pound dopey, cute, loving dog. Yeah, so I do have two poodles. Technically it's a different one, but, man, they're a lot of fun. They're a lot of fun, that's great.
Speaker 1:Well, I stopped my sentence short at the names Axel and Rowdy, and so I guess I'm glad I did that, because one of them would have been the one that's already passed.
Speaker 2:I'm glad you got a new one. Yeah, we're dog people for sure. I love that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you got a sense of that from your old bio. Like you talked a lot about your dogs.
Speaker 2:They're sweet. Yeah, they're fun. They're fun dogs.
Speaker 1:We grew up with them. All the things. That's awesome. We decided that if my wife were to have a podcast, it would be just like tell me about your dog, and she would just pull somebody on and have them talk about their dogs for an hour and she'd be perfectly happy with that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get it, I get it. There are a lot of fun. That's awesome, and so I moved.
Speaker 1:So you moved from St Pete, florida, over to Gilbert, arizona. I heard you recently on a podcast talk to Dr Brian Lenzkiss and say that you really loved Arizona. I think that was recorded before the summertime, so I was going to give you an opportunity to revise your statement. After having survived a summer in Arizona, it sounds like you're still in love with the place.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we do, we really like it. And you know we moved here so I could go back to school to become a naturopath like a naturopathic doctor Just finished my first year. It's technically our second summer. We kind of moved halfway through the summer last year so we didn't get the worst of it. But you know, compared to the humidity in Florida, Arizona's summers are not the worst. The humidity will really take it out of you in Florida and I can't say that about Arizona. Yes, it gets 120 degrees, but there's something to be said about dry heat that is just fantastic Totally.
Speaker 1:It's just hot. Up here in Salt Lake it's usually about 15 to 20 degrees cooler than it is down there. We've had some really hot days, especially last summer, and yeah, you're right, the dry heat it's like, yes, it's very hot, but you're not like pouring sweat out of the back of your knees or whatever.
Speaker 2:East coast is legit. Yeah, totally legit.
Speaker 1:Well, let's dive into your story. Eventually, you want to end up to the point of you deciding to move and doing the naturopathic doctor course. I think that's fantastic. Yeah, I think that's really going to be a great opportunity to hear what will be different about you and your career than it is now. We'll get there eventually. But first tell us about your history and your involvement with sports and athletics. It sounds like you've been interested in that for a very long time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I grew up in South Mississippi. I grew up out in the country. I grew up I had the best childhood ever. My grandfather took me hunting and fishing. I grew up kind of country girl in the land and I loved it. It was fantastic Very limited screen time, no social media, none of that stuff, no TVs, which I was really blessed with. I grew up with a boy cousin and I think that that's what kind of made me into an athlete. I just grew up around a lot of boys playing sports my whole life and so I had this passion and I had this desire to continue that on in college and so I had a lot of fun and I did grow up I will say this a little bit on the heavier side, so rewind a little bit I was adopted as a child.
Speaker 2:I was not breastfed. I don't really know a lot of my prenatal history so and that will come into play in a second so I was a heavier kid growing up. You know anything about the South. We all know the food in the South is very indulgent, very good, high fat, high sugar. My parents did great. They did the best they could with what they, the information they had, you know, but I wouldn't have said it was a quote unquote healthy diet. So anyway, I went into college a good athlete but definitely on the heavier side, and I just knew I started to know something was kind of amiss.
Speaker 2:My junior year of college I never really had any issues kind of like playing or anything, but I started first noticing issues with my cycle. So that was kind of the first red flag that I had was okay, like my cycle started to skip. I started to have like some of the hormonal symptoms that women starts to express and you know, cystic acne. Some of my hair was falling out, like it was. Just I started not to feel good. I started to get really oily skin, just things are like. I just wasn't feeling like top notch. I was still playing fine and I think probably the athleticism like had had tamp or like kept this down and massed a lot of these symptoms for years and years and years. But I was still probably 30, 45 pounds overweight.
Speaker 2:And so I went to the nurse on campus and I said you know the nurse practitioner I said, hey, something's up, like my cycle's gone, like I don't know what's going on. And you know, the typical thing at that time was well, you're probably just cause you're an athlete like you're running a lot, you you know you play all these games, you lift weights. You probably just need some birth control Then we can kind of figure it out. So they put me on birth control. That was the first line of defense against this and no other things. They didn't even take labs, which I look back now and I'm like holy moly, no labs were even pulled at that time, my junior year. So I got on birth control. That didn't really kind of mass some things for a couple of years Didn't really do anything much for me overall Then. It definitely didn't lose weight, if anything gains some. I didn't notice though I did have started to peak my interest in nutrition because I did notice when I started eating a little bit better, I noticed, okay, I feel a little better, the acne will stay away, like I feel a little sharper, I play a little bit better. That's originally what got me interested into dietetics and nutrition. I had no idea that dietetics was clinical. I had no idea I'd end up working in chronic disease. I just knew it affected my performance. So I started studying to be a dietitian and kind of fast forward a bit. I got my residency at a hospital down in Florida, at VA Bay Pines.
Speaker 2:I'm still having all these hormonal issues. They're progressively getting worse. They got way, way worse after my senior year of college, once I stopped athletics. I was still trying to keep up with workouts, but it was nowhere near these two-a-days, these 90-minute games. It was more or less just a 30-minute run, here and there maybe a 15, 20-minute weightlifting cycle. So you can imagine whatever symptoms I was masking with the excessive exercise have now kind of come on full force. So I'm working as a brand new dietitian at this hospital and these symptoms just hit me like a brick wall.
Speaker 2:I gained probably 25 pounds within a couple months of my first year as a dietitian and I'm getting progressively more brain fog, more sluggish. I'm getting worse acne you can just I look back at pictures and my face was just so inflamed and I was so puffy and I was having to take naps. I can remember feeling like I needed a nap every day around lunch. Just horrific, it was just a struggle. Every day was a struggle for me to just feel good. I was newly married pretty soon thereafter and I just felt really awful and I couldn't for the life of me figure out. Why is this happening? I'm a dietitian. I'm following At this point I made pretty significant changes in my diet.
Speaker 2:I was pretty well following the dietitian recommendations of eating whole grains, a lot of beans, a lot of the things, and I'm still getting worse and gaining more and more weight. No-transcript Get married and I go see an OBGYN because I know at this point like I really would really like to start thinking about children but I'm still having like no cycle and I'm on birth control but I want off and all these things. And the OBGYN like immediately goes oh well, you have PCOS, like I don't even need to take blood work. They did and eventually confirmed it but and said you have PCOS, we need to check your thyroid, do all these things, and said you need to be on metformin and spironolactone and kind of the typical PCOS treatment. And I was very frustrated and I was like well, how did this get missed? Like nobody has told me this. I was really frustrated because I Straight up ask him like, well, what can I do besides pharmaceuticals? He's oh, there's nothing. Like you're gonna need fertility treatments the whole nine yards and I remember walking out of that.
Speaker 2:That that was a pivotal day in my life because I remember walking out of that OBGYN Dr's office and thinking, okay, like challenge, accepted, I'm gonna. I'm not gonna let this beat me. This has taken four years of my life. At this point, I'm sick of being sick and tired. I'm sick of this weight. I'm sick of the way I feel. I'm sick of not having any energy to like go do adventures, or I feel good and I'm done. And that's when I really started diving headfirst into alternative therapies for treatments. Wow.
Speaker 1:Um, can I ask you a quick question as you're going through all of that you mentioned, you're getting trained your dietitian. Did you still have any in cleaning of a thought that, like diet is contributing to this, or in your mind, where you like, oh, I'm already doing the perfect diet? This must be something else. This is genetics or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I, I, I did think. I did think the the whole time. So I'm I would consider myself a little bit of a questioner, just in general, of rules in general, and I did think the whole time Something's not right. I'm eating exactly the way I learned to eat as a dietitian. Why is this not helping? There's something off. Why am I not losing weight? I'm following exactly what I have been taught to teach people. I I'm, quote-unquote supposed to be the professional in this right, like I'm supposed to be the food and nutrition Professional on weight loss. Why am I doing exactly what I've been taught to teach others? I, like this is supposed to be my career. How, why can't I get this weight off?
Speaker 2:And so, yes, the whole time I had a bit of a it was almost this like a bit of a sinking feeling or like a gut feeling. It wasn't a good feeling. Whatever it was, it wasn't a good feeling. It was a little I felt like an imposter. I'll say that much. I felt a little bit like it was a little bit of shame. It was a little bit of like, frustration, kind of all the things mixed in, of like why can't I figure this out? I was also really young like I, was like a 21 or 22 21 at the time and Didn't know a lot, hadn't had a lot of experience, and so, yeah, I, the whole time I had a lot of questions and I was really I Was searching for sure.
Speaker 1:Oh, use the word shame. That's what kind of I was thinking in the back of my mind. And and yeah, not the same experience, but similar your personal trainer like, like myself and you know I'm a nutrition coach, I've done this for a long time You're giving people the advice and telling them exactly what to do and they're repeatedly failing and failing and failing. You feel good kind of about yourself because, like, well, I told them what to do and they just simply can't do it. It's a whole different thing if you're watching your own health kind of deteriorate and you know you're doing all the things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah it was, and it was especially frustrating because I was really feeling like conventional medicine, especially after the appointment with the OBGYN. I was really frustrated with the lack of Options as well. I was like, well, this can't be, it like this is all you have. Your, your board certified OB, like that's all you have. For me has met foreman, you know, like a sporona lack like this can't be, this can't be the only solution. But you're, you're absolutely right in, and I was. It was.
Speaker 2:It's like one of those things. Or you're sitting there and you're Talking to someone who's obese and and struggling with their weight and then, but you're also struggling with your weight and so like they're crying, but you also want to cry. So it's like this. It's a very interesting dynamic and I think I'm very glad for it, though I'll say that much because I believe that I believe that that time of my life, without that time of my life, I would not be where I am now. I believe that that part of my testimony is a hundred percent why I like have the, have the experience to do what I'm doing now. But yeah, it was a very it wasn't an easy. It wasn't an easy couple years for sure.
Speaker 1:Did you ever think about doing something different for your career? Did you ever think like this just is not for me, like did that cross your mind?
Speaker 2:I did, I did and a lot of dietitians do kind of like random things, like some will go into research or some will go work for like food corporations and do like meal plans or work for restaurants and do. I Really considered I didn't even know dietitians worked in chronic disease, and I believe in a Higher power to a great deal and I really I didn't even know dietitians worked in chronic disease. When I started to get into it I was just an ignorant kind of like jock college player who was like, oh, I like sports, I like sports and food makes me feel good, so I'll like study this. You know, I didn't know what I wanted to do, but again, I really feel like I was pushed in this direction because of this experience and then Knowing now what I know, it's like, oh yeah, this was totally the whole will for my life.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I did. I thought several times like I could totally use this degree and take it and go do like go work for whoever and Make meal plans or something, or go work in a nursing home and just do them the menu planning or something. Yeah, it was. I had many of those days where I was like this this is just not right, because you do, you feel like a full-on imposter.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally. We've already mentioned Dr Lenskis, but also, like Dr Tro, they mentioned being doctors very, very overweight and obese. They're trying to get their people to do the right things. What, what can they say at that point? Like that they can't really do anything helpful because they're struggling with it themselves. They're trying to follow the advice and it's not working and so so frustrating. And I love looking back on our lives and and seeing those those bottom moments, that that lead us to where we're supposed to go, and I think it's really cool that you recognize it as that. I think, yeah, it really could have gone either way like that. It went this certain way for you. I think you're right, it must be something divine, because you could have just as easily gotten lost in other rabbit holes and gotten really like worse information. But what happened? What changed? How did you end up getting the good information?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, this is a great question and I and I tell this to my clients all the time Don't give up, because there is so much information out there that it can be very overwhelming when you're first kind of Getting like you're trying to gather your thoughts, like okay, what's my next step, what do I need to do next, like what's gonna work for me. But I said that day and leaving the OB was a very pivotal day for me I decided that day that like okay, like challenge accepted, like you're that I'm not gonna. Metformin and spironolactone isn't gonna be what heals this for me and sure enough, it doesn't for 99.99% of the people. Buti I Started. I will say this the metformin prescription got my wheels turning. So he prescribed me metformin and I thought in my head I was like, okay, wait a second, you're giving me a diabetes medication to control PCOS and Spironolactone. So I started to look into the actual functions and like what these medications act on, how they work, what they do, how they move glucose, how they act in the liver, etc. And so that is what got my wheels turning and so I was like, okay, he's giving me these medications, birth control, whatever, that just is kind of a bandaid but and I started thinking, oh, shoot, like this is a glucose insulin issue, like, what, like, oh, like I get it now. And so that is what sparked my Curiosity about a PCOS essentially being diabetes, diabetes of the ovaries. And so that is what initially got me into Okay, like now I kind of have this idea in my head, sparks from this metformin prescription. And then that's when I got, like got onto Google.
Speaker 2:Honestly, in the first couple things that popped up for me, the first thing that I got my hands on was the obesity code by Jason dr Jason phone. The second thing I know. The second thing I got my hands on and I couldn't read that book fast enough. I think I finished that book in a day and a half. I kids, you not I got it on Amazon and I finished it so quickly and I, it was it, and I was giving them away. I was buying them and giving them away to doctors that I was working with at the VA because I was so like, wait, why does everyone not know this? Why is every dietitian not have to read this book? Then the second book I got my hand on that I I've, I've promised you I think I bought over 20 of his books as dr Beckman's. Yep, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know, I know he probably thinks I'm crazy because I talk about him on every podcast, and no, I don't think he thinks that, but I I give that book away so frequently because I think every medical or potential medical Professional should read that book, because I didn't get one one second of education on Insulin resistance.
Speaker 2:Yes, I know all the pathways. Yes, I memorized the Krebs cycle. Yes, I could, I could recite to you every single all the things from learning that in as a dietitian, but nobody had ever put all the things together for me Like he had in that book and I. That was the second book that I read and that is when the light bulb went on for me and I Was then like a vacuum to all the this information that I could not stop. And I then got onto the Verda health website and then I got I mean, I couldn't stop. I was ordering book after book after book and YouTubeing and podcasting and it just I couldn't turn it off and and it immediately started, of course.
Speaker 2:So, like, within a few days, I had cut 90% of the carbs out of my life and I wasn't even eating that. I mean, I was eating. I was eating beans and legumes and whole grains and quinoa and couscous and all the healthy dietitiany Things that I thought were doing me a favor. And juicing, oh my gosh, all the things that, like you think are, are like, oh, cleansing and doing all these things that were actually just like wrecking my blood glucose and wrecking my insulin and Just absolutely destroying my hormones. And so within like three or four days, I had just absolutely basically broken it down to like steak, chicken, fish, eggs and non-starchy vegetables and olive oil, and I wouldn't even really eat a ton of nuts. I mean, I think nuts are fine, they just weren't super helpful for me at the time. But I had broken it down to that and and and.
Speaker 2:Within like two or three weeks I've lost like 13 14 pounds, like just absolutely Decistic acne had. I didn't even have an issue with that. You know, I think I took met foreman for maybe a week and I was like this is terrible. I don't feel well on this. This is screwing my stomach up like. This is just awful.
Speaker 2:And so, um, after just over consuming just about every low carb, ketogenic, metabolic health podcast resource book, I could get my hand good calories, bad calories by Gary Tobbs, vinny Torture I could go on all of their books. I was just reading everything I could get my hands on. I started to immediately feel better within a couple of weeks and I was like, okay, I'm onto something. And then that turned into like two, three months. I had lost like 30 pounds and my cycle returned in like two months, full on normal ovulation cycle. No help, no, birth control got off birth control like no problem, all the things. And you know I was just like it was that easy. Like you know, I'd struggled for years and all I needed was just a little bit of information.
Speaker 1:Wow, that's incredible. Yeah, jason Fung was instrumental in my understanding. I'd been using metabolic hearts for over a decade to measure metabolism. The listener will be sick of this story. I've told this story probably a hundred times.
Speaker 1:But people would come in. People would come in doing intermittent fasting and I would think like, okay, well, you're not eating very many calories. You just told me what you eat and it's not very many calories. Your metabolic rate is going to be low. Run a test and their metabolic rate is way higher than it should have been, even at like a normal level. These people turned into these crazy fat burners and they were just chewing through fat like crazy and they feel amazing.
Speaker 1:That's how I found all this entire world to begin with. And I just I have to say Ben Bickman, and what an amazing, amazing guy he is. He goes to the wrong school. It's 30 minutes down the road from here at BYU, but that's okay. Well, forgive him for that. I've got about 10 minutes left to go in the episode that you did with him on your podcast. I have to just take a quick diversion and ask what was it like to be able to have him on your show and ask him questions and communicate with the man who literally changed your understanding of all of this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I'll say this about Dr Bickman. I talk about him on just about every podcast that I'm featured on One. He's the nicest person that I've really, truly met in this space. Like, he's genuinely as nice as you would expect him to be. I think he portrays that he's very kind over social media, but he is genuinely just as kind off air that he is on air, I guess you could say but he is extremely smart and you almost feel like it's he's just he's extremely smart but also extremely humble. And, yeah, it is a real honor for me and I have the privilege of writing some of the blogs for Health Code, which is the protein powder company that he and his brother, joel, have founded. And, yeah, they're both. It's just an incredibly kind and genuine person and, I think, one of the most respectable people, not just in like, academically speaking, in terms of like. Obviously he's a complete brainiac and is well above most of us in IQ, but he really truly is one of the kindest people that I've interacted with in this low-carb space.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's amazing. I would submit that even if you didn't know anything about the topics that we're talking about, if you listen to him talk and then listen to maybe somebody like a vegan doctor or something, if you had no knowledge of the space, I believe you would still be able to tell that one person is speaking very carefully, very deliberately. They're saying what they know and what they don't know. Where the other side is more just kind of like emotion, and we think that and everybody knows that and experts agree that you know what I mean Like there's a big difference in hearing those two types of people talk.
Speaker 2:Yes, and he always is very. What I really like about him too, and I really respect this, is that he is very. He's always, and I think we should all take note of this and really judge who we listen to in these types of settings. On this note is he's always very careful about saying like this was a in vivo study or a rat study or here's another study that showed this, that kind of contradicting. He's very like, like, he's very. It's not like his way or the highway, and you can very well tell that even when he talks about studies, that like he's done or whatever. Yeah, he's very like.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you listen to one of he's done like a debate kind of with oh man, it's one of the like calories in, calories out, guys, I don't know, but yes, it's he's. I would agree with you. He's very careful about what he says and he's very like science should always be questioned, which I really admire out of that, and it's very like I hope we find out more and we've got to find out more and keep going and going and going and it's not definitive and all that. So, yes, I would 100% back that up with what you said it's very cautious.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's amazing. So I didn't know. He did a debate with anybody, was it, for example? Was it like Lane Norton, if you recall?
Speaker 2:No, no no, it wasn't. Although that would be, I would definitely. That would be epic Pay money to see that? No, it was with. I think it was with the. It's not safe and I'll have to look it up and send it to you. I don't know that you would have considered a debate, but it was like back and forth about calories in versus calories out and like the different. But it was like him and, I think, two other guys on food. Maybe it was the Food Lies Guy podcast.
Speaker 2:I don't know, I'll look for it. Yeah, I'll look for it and let you know, but it was a great podcast and he made great points and it was just very well done.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's awesome. Okay, well, going back to your story, this is kind of putting you at a bit of an awkward kind of period in your life because you're still training to be a registered dietician and you're learning essentially kind of the opposite of what you are being taught. What is that like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, you know what. So when I had implemented, started implementing this, I was actually about nine months in, I think, as a full RD. I had passed my RD exam, I had gotten hired at the hospital that I was an intern at and I was actually working in like mostly diabetes and metabolic disease Like I had done. I did home case or home-based primary care, but it also covered a ton in the diabetes clinic and anybody that was absent in the actual hospital setting. So, like inpatient all that outpatient I did a lot of an outpatient clinic, which is mostly diabetes, hypertension management, et cetera, and so, yes, it was a bit of a young life crisis and I was having a very hard time, not just word, vomiting everything that I knew on everyone and saying like you need to like stop eating carbs, like get, if you want off all this medication, like get, do this, like read this book.
Speaker 2:And because I was brand new and I was like the young one on the totem pole and like I had just started and all these doctors and endocrinologists had been there for 25 years and who am I to question anything and all this other stuff, and but you know what? I started to counsel veterans anyway, and you know, what really helps me is VerteHealth, which is have you heard of VerteHealth?
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely, they're amazing.
Speaker 2:C-I-R-T-A. So they did a study at the hospital. They did a study with veterans. It wasn't necessarily localized to the hospital I was at, but I was able to enroll veterans that I was working with in the VerteHealth study and I enrolled several veterans of my caseload into this study. Wow, it was all on ketosis. They were letting them in for free, which VerteHealth is pretty expensive. It's not expensive, but if insurance doesn't cover it, whatever. Anyway, there were veterans in VerteHealth and they were doing a study on them.
Speaker 2:I had a couple of kind of my favorites and I enrolled them in the study and the results were, I mean, shocking, doesn't even do it justice. Like one guy got completely off all insulin and got down to like the lowest dose, met foreman. He lost like 96 pounds, something just like crazy, and like less than a year. And so I had all these like stories of these guys that I had enrolled with VerteHealth and they were putting on my ketogenic diet. And this doctor from this outpatient clinic that I was kind of working hand in hand with, very open-minded doctor, very like not stuck in her ways, she was like whoa, like there's something to this and I'm thinking, yeah, like I already knew there was, but I'm glad that you see it as well and I'm thankful that VerteHealth gave us that opportunity, and so that was really pivotal. In that moment I said you know what there's like proof in the pudding. I'm just gonna start doing low carb keto with these guys, and so I was teaching they had these things called move classes, which this is four years out, I don't know if they still do this, but I was teaching these classes like a 16 week long weight loss class essentially, and I like changed all the curriculum to low carb and like I was switching things. I mean I probably would have gotten in a lot of trouble. I mean I did get kind of reprimanded onto some things, but I didn't really care because I knew what worked.
Speaker 2:And so, yeah, I just started switching things and people were seeing the results. I mean people were other endocrinologists at different outpatient clinics were sending me their clients from like I worked in St P. I was getting clients from across town. They were coming from different clinics that they should go to closer clinics to my clinic. Like it was getting crazy. And like the diabetes clinic, people were dropping their A1Cs. One of the nurses in the diabetes clinic like worked with me like it was just this crazy, like turn of events, and I started to get some confidence here. I am like at the time 22, 22, 23 maybe and I was just it was just crazy and I was. The results speak for themselves, like they truly do. They just people were losing weight, getting off all these medications and I was having conversations with I still talk to some of these veterans 10 years later and so it was just amazing. It was truly amazing.
Speaker 1:That's incredible. Yeah, it's such a relatable experience. Once you find this world, you get totally obsessed with it and then you start to see all the results you're getting for people and it's totally addictive. So it sounds like the reception to some of your things. You got pushed back, but it wasn't so aggressive like would you say. The result was kind of like more neutral.
Speaker 2:I would say it got more pushed back from other dietitians than I did from physicians, although, yeah, I wouldn't say neutral. It was a little bit more hostile than I would say neutral. I got a little bit of pushback. A lot of dietitians were very anti-low-carb, anti-keto. I was getting more pushback from my actual colleagues than I was like upper management than anything. It was other dietitians that were very not cool with it, which is fine, like we all know the science behind it now especially. Even then we knew, but it was fine and I didn't really care because my patients were the ones that were losing 60 pounds and their patients weren't, and their patients were coming and so it was like and there was like one or two in particular, it wasn't all of them.
Speaker 2:I worked with some phenomenal dietitians and some of them I still talk to today I'm friends with. Today there was just a couple that were like oh, I don't really like this, you're kind of pushing the boundaries, you're not preaching what the dietitians were taught to preach and we don't like that. But I've always been a little bit on the again a rule pusher and again, I'm not one to spout something over and over again if it's not working. And the Verda Health Study, like I mean, you've seen it, you can go look, everyone can go look it up on VA veterans, like the results speak for themselves. Again, we weren't getting results as dietitians, like the Verda Health was, and so why would I continue preaching the same nonsense when Verda Health was dropping people's A1Cs by like seven points, you know?
Speaker 2:So it's like I'm just not the one to like. I want the best for my clients and so I'm willing to take the pushback if it means that my clients are gonna get off insulin and stop gaining weight, and so I was willing to take that. Now I will say ultimately it did lead to me quitting the VA, like I was just tired of the governmental bureaucracy and red tape. I love the veterans. I come from a family, a background of military and all of it, and I would gladly serve veterans any day, every day again. I just would never work at a conventional medical system again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that makes sense and that also kind of answers the question of why you're doing additional training today so you can practice in the way that you like. I think this would be a nice time to take a quick diversion and maybe explain what it is about, what Virta was doing, what you were discovering, what is it about low carbohydrate nutrition, ketogenic nutrition if somebody's listening and they're like yeah, I saw Keto on a magazine cover at the grocery store, but that just looks like a lot of bacon like and they kind of get like confused about what it is. Can you explain what ketosis is and why it's beneficial for chronic disease in this magnitude?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so great question, because this gets really convoluted. A lot of people think Keto is a fad diet, when it is unfortunately does take on that definition now because of social media, and media has made it that. But in reality, ketosis is just a metabolic process, and so Keto in the hands of the wrong people looks like a lot of bacon, butter, very high processed fat, even to some degree processed food, when in reality, ketosis is just a different way to metabolize and make energy. And so when we're talking about chronic disease and we're talking about metabolic health getting someone, getting someone's metabolism their ability to burn ketones as energy is very, very effective and very, very useful when it comes to helping them lower their risk of chronic disease, lower their weight, lower their A1C, lower inflammation, protect their cognitive function, et cetera, so on and so forth. Essentially, we're switching them from using glucose as fuel to using ketones as fuel, and ketones can be made in the liver from dietary fat and or body fat.
Speaker 2:Now, a lot of myths and things come along from keto.
Speaker 2:A lot of times people think, oh, if I go keto, I'll never eat carbs again.
Speaker 2:Not true, you just have to eat them strategically and you have to eat the right ones, and you just have to get to a place where your body can handle them correctly.
Speaker 2:A lot of people with chronic disease have just gotten to a place where they just don't tolerate carbohydrates. Well, it's not even that they can never eat them again, they're just eating too much of them too frequently, eating too often and eating too high fat alongside the carbohydrates, and so when we remove one of the other and in my way and people that use low-carb and keto we take away carbs and to some degree sometimes take away fat. If we're taking away processed food, we do high protein. I teach a relatively high protein keto, so I would say it's moderate to high protein and moderate fat and then obviously very low carb. But essentially, to answer your question, what we're doing is we're switching their metabolic process to teach their body how to use its own fat, its own stored fat, for fuel again, and that is just a process we have not tapped into by our environmental food standards and the way that our environment is set up nowadays. It's just we don't ever. We eat too frequently, too often, too indulgent, etc.
Speaker 1:Yeah, ketosis is so important that it warrants one. It warrants one entire sentence in my 600-page nutrition manual behind me, one sentence that says anything about ketogenesis, ketosis. That's it One sentence and you're describing an entire process that optimizes so many different things. It's absolutely amazing all the things that it can treat and it can deal with, as Ben excellently puts forth in his book. Like we see all these different diseases really they're just branches of the same tree.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%. And a lot of people think like and unfortunately this is the way that social media and media has made it out to be is like. Again, they think, oh, fat diet, I'm only going to eat this way for the rest of my life. In reality, it's just another tool in the toolbox to use to get you to a place that you want to be, the same way that any dietary pattern ever would be. You just need to essentially help your body like, improve its metabolic function, and that's what we do when we take away carbohydrates and get you quote unquote in ketosis.
Speaker 2:And so, yeah, there's a lot of myths, there's a lot of things around it, but nearly every chronic disease, like you said Dr Beckman described so well, and why we get sick is, it has either roots in it or is directly stemmed from insulin resistance. It's like gas to a flame, you know, and so it truly is. Once you can take that, factor out, your health, your mental clarity, the way you feel, your hormones, I mean, the list goes on and on. And we're only continually I say we, he and all the other researchers who are looking at this stuff are continually are continuing to figure out more and more things are coming from it essentially Yep.
Speaker 1:I love that. I like also how you landed on a higher protein version for most people, and I think this is where people need to be a little bit more mindful and really sit down and think about what do I, what am I seeking from this particular lifestyle, life and lifestyle, because for most of us, I would say, our main goal is not to just drive up ketones to be as high as possible. In that situation you would want to kind of limit your proteins a little bit, because they can, you know, suppress ketones a little bit. And so if you have bipolar or you know you're very diabetic and you need to be more strict, that might be something you know cancer treatments. If you're doing that, that might be a reason why. But for most of us, you know, we want to have good energy, we want to have good muscle mass. Higher protein seems a lot more necessary in that situation.
Speaker 2:A lot more necessary and a lot more realistic long term. So I tend to only do the higher fat stuff with those very same situations that you mentioned very life threatening cancer treatments, neurodegenerative diseases, epilepsy, things that are very serious and that we need to treat triage correctly and that we need to fix quick, not fix quickly, but like we're talking, we've got a triage right, we've got life or death and or very serious matters on our hands, and so we're. The higher protein stuff is absolutely correct. It's more functional, it's easier to do long term, you feel full longer, you run into less issues, side effects wise, so on and so forth. But yeah, I'm a big fan of higher protein ketone, not worried about driving those ketones up into the twos, even the threes. We don't need it that high to see fantastic results. And so, yeah, I concur, it's a great point.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when you make such a good point talking about the state of ketosis, and while I think most of us are noticing a little bit of a downward trend in the word keto and keto things that are popping up, what you're describing is always useful. That's always useful. You should never want to be too far out of a state of ketosis. You'd want to kind of build your base at least somewhere near that kind of lifestyle 100% in a sign of a healthy metabolism.
Speaker 2:Like, even if you're not following a ketogenic lifestyle to some degree, most people that are metabolically healthy should be waking up with some level of ketones in their blood. You know, if you're a generally active adult, you should be having some degree of ketones in your blood in the morning. Like it just should be like if you're metabolically healthy, even if you're not necessarily restricting carbohydrates extremely low. And so, yes, yeah, I would agree, like it just is. It doesn't have to be. People have just developed this very restrictive kind of put keto in a box and a bubble mindset. And again, media, social media, the whole nine yards. But yes, it is, it is a sign of a optimally functioning metabolic system.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree with you, and the way you explained carbohydrates earlier I thought was very interesting, because you didn't say that they were bad. It's just that we're eating them too many times or not seasonally anymore. So an exercise I'll give to some of my clients is like, okay, I'm taking away all the restaurants and grocery stores and you go outside right now and try to live. And first of all, like it's shocking how few plants you could even eat if you wanted to. Most of them have no, you know, nutrition value for a human. And secondly, like here we're end of summer.
Speaker 1:At the time of recording here in Salt Lake City, I know of four fruit trees around and they're ripe. So, yes, you could go to those trees and you could eat as much fruit as you like. You're competing with other animals and you know you only get them for like a week or two, but you could have as many as you like and that's fine, because there's going to be a few weeks from now, unfortunately, that the snow is going to fly around here and those are going to go away, and so I think, thinking about it in that way, oh, okay, this makes a lot of sense If I'm eating carbohydrates all day, every day, for 40 years. That's going to be a problem 100%.
Speaker 2:And, yes, like those very same patterns that you're describing are. What has led people to become insulin resistant and metabolically unhealthy is the constant carbs. And it all comes down to the ease of access to foods, right? Nobody has a problem just driving down the street, we go to the grocery store and we can get as much fruit as we want, but not only fruit, like bags of chips, cartons of ice cream, cake, candy, whatever we want is at access all the times, and most of us, if we're being honest, probably have some of that in our house, and so it just develops. It's just we have become so far removed from natural tendencies and natural patterns of eating and whole food eating and all of that that that has become the root cause of all of this. And when you, when you boil it back down to getting enough protein, even down to the fiber, and filling up on vegetables and things like that, it really, it really solves a lot of those issues. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1:I was just thinking. As we were talking about apples, I was like, if only it were just apples. It's all the stuff in the middle that's so deliciously tempting. That is the real problem.
Speaker 2:I know, I know, I know and you know.
Speaker 2:One thing too that I was thinking of is you'll find that once people heal at least with my clients and myself too like just from wearing CGMs and biohacking and looking at these things like when you followed low carb and you've healed your metabolism, like I can go and eat a significant amount of watermelon and or do something like that half fruit, or even like have something that may be like an almond flour cupcake or something and have a pretty significant blood glucose spike, but be in ketosis the next day and so and I've seen that with some of my clients, as a lot of my clients as well is like once you kind of take care of the.
Speaker 2:Now I'm not saying you should do this all the time by any means, I'm not saying this is a good strategy to employ, but I'm saying it does give you a lot of food freedom, because a lot of people say, oh, that's so restrictive. But no, once you've actually healed your body and you've done the work on the front end and you've created lean muscle mass and you're moving all the time and you're doing all these things, like those things that you've worried about in the past are really not that much of an issue, again, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1:That does make sense and that doesn't trigger further cravings for you.
Speaker 2:It can. I mean, I'm very cautious about that kind of stuff. I have red light and green light foods. I kind of talk about that with my clients, like there's some things I will not bring in the house. Same thing with, like, my husband and my kid, like there's just things that if we're going to have it, we're going to have it out in a controlled setting and where it's like okay, once it's done, it's done. We're not going to go out of our way. But we don't bring anything in the house Like we don't have. We don't have any sweets in our house, we don't have any ice cream, cake, candy, anything, because we we still have littles.
Speaker 2:If if we do have something like it's kind of an event and we'll make like homemade chocolate chip cookies with almond flour and stevia and my kids will help make it, and it's a two hour thing and like by the time you end up making the dang things like nobody's even, like it's just like you know they eat one or two and then they're off outside playing again.
Speaker 2:So it's just like, not a, it's like a treat and a fun thing. But we just try to try not to be too restrictive but also like enjoy things. Here and there. We're about to go on vacation, we're about to go to Disney World, literally on Saturday, and so like, yeah, I'll probably have a bite or two of something. And then, you know, another thing we do is we'll split something as a family, so like if we get a dessert, or like it's a kid's birthday or something, and we'll get like a small piece of cake, we'll get a small piece of cake for all four of us, yeah, you know. And so everyone ends up with like two bites of something. So it's like you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Very different than crushing an entire sleeve of Oreos every afternoon. That makes it fun, the kids will remember it. And again, you know you're dealing with in yourself. Very different to somebody like me or somebody like Ben Bickman, who described on your podcast like if he has cold cereal he can't stop himself. And I pushed back him on him on this one when we hosted him on our show. He said that Frosted Mini Wheats is like his favorite cereal and I told him like, objectively, scientifically, absolutely not. There's so many better cereals than Frosted.
Speaker 2:Mini Wheats.
Speaker 1:Come on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I would say that there are some foods like and it totally, totally depends. Like if you would have asked me that question six years ago, the answer would have been completely different. Like I would have not been able to just sit and split one cake with my family six years ago. That would have not happened. I would have been upset that I wasn't getting my own. Like my hormones would have wanted more. Like I really when I was dealing with a PCOS.
Speaker 2:Pcos and binge eating go hand in hand. For the record, for anyone who doesn't, I mean the hormones, and a lot of people think that that's like a discipline issue. No, that is a full blown hormonal. Some of it may be like emotional, psychological stuff, but your hormones take over with PCOS, any insulin resistance, any, anything like that. It is so powerful. You will never win against your hormones.
Speaker 2:I tell my clients that all the time like discipline is one thing, like yes, but you have got to set up protective barriers for yourself because hormones will win almost all the time unless you have put in. That's why I say keep the crap out of your house, like don't make it hard, like you're not going to get up at midnight Some people might and drive to Walmart or something like that to get food. But you know, so I say that with caution because it all depends on that stage of like, where you are and knowing your, your, your health and knowing, like, what food is what, because not all. I can't do that with all foods and I would agree cold cereal. There's something, there's something real special about cold cereal because it will wreck you, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:No, I totally agree with the hormones. It's interesting to think too that, like when I go to a Brazilian steakhouse, I think I'm going to put these guys out of business. Different hormones, but they are hormones that tell you you have to stop after 45 minutes. I literally can't chew food anymore. It's crazy how powerful they are on both sides.
Speaker 2:On both sides and that is one of the principal foundations that I teach in my course is like we don't need to worry about restriction so much, as if we focus so much on what you can't have how to heal your hormones first, then the the kicking, the sugar cravings, and getting rid of the binge eating and all of that kind of comes naturally when you're I mean, it's hard to binge eat when you've had a huge amount of protein, like it's just not something that's easy to do. Now I'm not saying there's some work that comes with that, but yes, like it is, it works on both sides, but it takes some time and a lot of grace comes with that and patience as well, because it can be a challenge for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, interesting, Okay. Well, you've already mentioned PCOS lots of times. Understandable that that would be your area of specialty, and we've pushed into giving your history Low carbohydrate diets, ketogenic diets and I would even throw carnivore diets. We see more women trying no carbohydrate, carnivore diets. Are you concerned? Are you worried? Should women be cycling carbohydrates with their cycle Like what? Where do you sit as far as that goes?
Speaker 2:Yeah, great question. So, yeah, the answer to this is I'm kind of 50 50. So I'm all for carnivore in certain scenarios. So I think carnivore can be really, really, really extremely helpful for auto immunity, for things of that nature, for healing things. I am not certain or sure people are going to stay with it for the rest of their life. I just I just don't know. I just don't know it. I don't think we have the data on it. I think there are some of the anecdotal like oh, this is an 86 year old, 96 year old woman who's been carnivore except so on and so forth. So I'm kind of in the wait and see camp of that group. But it is a subset of keto and most carnivores are getting into ketosis most of the time, and so I like it for that, for that manner.
Speaker 2:I do wonder about one thing I don't like about the, the the carnivore thing is I I'm not sure about the whole attack on vegetables. I don't necessarily know that they're as helpful as they've been made out to be. I also don't think they're as harmful as they're being made out to be right now. So I don't think that they have superpowers. I don't think that they're going to give you cancer and kill you either. So I kind of fall somewhere in the in the middle of that one as well. I haven't. I know that there's some people that say, oh well, there's this research, but I haven't really seen great research on the whole. Like I understand less of things and oxalates and 100% plant paradox. I get all of that stuff for people that may be susceptible for that kind of stuff, but for the average healthy adult I'm just not sure that having a avocado here and there, olives or a little bit of you know cooked asparagus is going to be like the end of the world.
Speaker 1:Very thoughtful answer. I really appreciate that, especially since I changed my mind about this like every three minutes. If you give me an answer that's 50 50, I can be right either way. That's amazing.
Speaker 2:I know right, yeah, it's hard and it's so individualized, right? Because if you were someone that was having debilitating ulcerative colitis and you were emaciated and you were on your deathbed about to get a colic to me, go carnivore, no questions asked, I would have no hesitation. So it's very like. It really truly is such an individualized like process and it would totally depend on the client and what, what they were struggling with. If, if you know I'm open, I'm fine with that. I've had many carnivore clients, I've done carnivore myself in periods and so, like I'm open to it, I'm just I'm just kind of like hesitant to say carnivore is the only way, the rest of the way for the. There's no other way for the. For the end of time, I don't fall in that camp either.
Speaker 1:I love that, no, that's amazing. Sally Norton I got a meter in person earlier this year. We've interviewed her twice, obviously author on oxalate and the harms of oxalate, and amazing content, like, really amazing content. She's absolutely not wrong. Like, I believe her. When I, when I stop and think about it, I don't see that day to day. I it's just those are not the people that I'm dealing with. You mentioned, like the, the, the juicing. Like if you're doing what you and I were doing 10 years ago and you're throwing spinach and beets and almond juice, I want to blend her every single morning. You might end up having an issue, but practically I don't know that it's becoming like a huge issue for most people. Go keto, however you like, and let's, let's knock off 40 pounds and get you more insulin sensitive. That's going to be the bigger priority.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent, and there's so many other things that we have to consider too, like and I've learned a lot of this just from being back in school but like are we looking at people's environmental pollution? Or like environmental toxins? Like, have they been exposed to metals? Are they cleaning up their products? Are they rubbing filates all over them and that's causing them insuliners? Like I mean, we could take this a million different directions, and there really are a lot of things out there that are harming us and that are not doing us any good. I'm just not a hundred percent, like you said, sold that that vegetables is like number one killer on the top.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean, but I do agree with Sally Norton's work to some degree. Like, oxalates are a huge issue for a subset of people and they certainly cannot tolerate them. I've worked with several people with IBD that are like they can't you know, and you just have to know that about yourself and adjust accordingly.
Speaker 1:Yep, yeah, adjust, that's a great way to say it. I mean, even Sally, she eats vegetables, just different kinds. She had a problem with oxalate, so she knows how to sub out the high ones for the lower ones. And then we always have to remember that things like that are an accumulation. They don't accumulate greatly for everybody. So so, yeah, maybe we don't need to get too much into the minutia and just worry about you know what? What the most important thing is. I love the saying the goal is to keep the goal of the goal. Let's focus on the most important priority.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the individual, right, and I say this because, like you know, you work with so many different people and so many different stages of life and so many different backgrounds and customs and cultures and life stages and like, what's realistic for you and your life and your family may be completely not even approachable for them in that moment.
Speaker 2:And really, like, as someone who works with people, we just have to meet them halfway. You know, like what, what can we fix right now that's going to make the biggest difference in your life, and then what can we move on to next? And so a lot of my work is not like sometimes I'm not even switching somebody fully to keto, like sometimes we're just like I'm just trying to get them off soda, you know, like that may be the number one thing that like we got to fix right now, and then we can come and work on the bread and the pasta and the other things. And so, like you know, it's just all about like the individual and prioritizing, like what they can handle, what they can manage, and taking their, their, their needs and all of you know their situation into into consideration.
Speaker 1:Totally Very reasonable, really doable for everybody. And, on that note, can you tell us how you are working with people? You've mentioned, your course? How do you, how do you run your coaching these days, especially while you're in school, like are you slammed?
Speaker 2:All on. Yeah, you know I am slammed, but I love what I'm learning in school and I love, I love what I do with my clients. My clients are like the few. I just love help. I love working with the women that I work with. So I run a full on telemedicine private practice. So full time registered dietitian I get.
Speaker 2:I use social media to get all of my clients and essentially what I do is I, I help them with. I help them navigate bloodwork. So we look through bloodwork and and try to spot anything that may be holding them back from weight loss. And we I helped them come up with a protocol to treat that. Nothing super over complicated, nothing super expensive, nothing out of you reach. And they work with me for a couple months and I send them on their way, give them a, you know, like I said, a protocol. And so, yeah, I have a program. I do, like I said, telemedicine zoom chat message. I use an app that I have. It's called practice better, but it's a lot of fun. I I feel really honored and then I go to class when I'm not doing that. So it's, it's good.
Speaker 1:That's amazing, Do you? Do you have a clear vision of what your practice is going to be like once you graduate?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so in DDS naturopathic doctors in the West are basically primary care providers so we can write all meds except like very high level painkillers like Benzos, and then in some ADHD medications we can't use, which is fine, because I have no interest in any of that anyway. So I want to have a brick and mortar. So I've done telemedicine for so long but I truly miss the face. I see people face to face. I miss human interaction day to day.
Speaker 1:It's different.
Speaker 2:But there are so many therapies that conventional medicine does not provide people that are incredibly helpful. I mean peptides I don't know if you're familiar with CJC, epimoralin and BPC-157, all these different peptides and nutritional IVs and in a lot of the Indies in Arizona, we'll do if people want to do botox, and that's not necessarily my realm. But you can provide all that as a naturopath, and so I want to work in obesity medicine with a brick and mortar somewhere in Arizona. I've thrown around Utah, I've thrown around New Mexico. I don't know where I'll land for sure, but yeah, I want a full brick and mortar. If it was up to me, I'll have multiple. So I'm excited, it'll be really great. I think people are running to natural medicine. There's just not enough of us to handle it, and so, yeah, I think it's really really good.
Speaker 1:For what you do and how you help people. That seems like the perfect marriage between giving them, like you said, what people are flocking to, which is natural remedies and proper diet and education and that kind of thing, with also the ability to use medicine for what it can be very beneficial for. And yeah, if somebody needs a medicine temporarily, they need a pill, like yes, they need it. Like that's all very important.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%. And that's where I try to be really outspoken, because I'm a fan of conventional medicine. Sometimes people think, oh, you know you hate conventional medicine. No, conventional medicine saved my daughter's life. Conventional medicine is life saving. It is absolutely 100% necessary. Where conventional medicine falls short is prevention and chronic disease management and I think natural medicine really excels in that area. Where natural medicine falls short is heart attacks and things where people need life saving conventional medicine, and I think the two can really bond and really be critical.
Speaker 2:I was talking, I was on Dr Linskitz's podcast and talking to him about this. I think that, like, if you find a, my goal would be to find an MD like him or somebody similar that can help provide the conventional side and I could provide the natural side. And so, yeah, I think it's a. I think it's kind of a match made in heaven. If you find the right person, there's a. There's a quite a battle between MDs and NDs that goes on in the, the, you know whatever world medicine world, but I think it's ridiculous and I think that the two can really provide such good when working together. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I totally agree with you, temple. This has been an amazing hour. I can't believe an hour has already flown by. This has been a super fun conversation, I think. Very education. I think a lot of people will walk away from this conversation feeling more comfortable and confident with the lifestyle practices that aren't necessarily being taught by the medical industry. So thank you so much for taking the time to stop by. Where do you want people to go to find you, to connect with you and your work?
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you, it was an honor. Thanks for having me on. Everyone can find me basically on every platform. I'm at the dot ketogenic dot nutritionist. Find me on Instagram, follow me there. I'm on YouTube Subscribe to my channel there. I'm on tick talk Go there. I'm on Twitter Go there. So, whatever your listeners, you know like the the most they can find me on.
Speaker 1:Awesome and that's the best place to like DM you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I would say Instagram is the best place to DM me. I'm most active there in terms of answering. It's just a little easier to use. But, yeah, they can DM me, ask me any questions, follow along, it's. Yeah, I really try to be responsive with my following, so, yeah, that's great and you're awesome podcast.
Speaker 1:You're going to keep that going as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I am, I am. I have one really sync today. I don't know if you know Daniel Hamilton, she's I have one with her coming out.
Speaker 2:She's awesome. I have a podcast with Laura Adler, who's an environmental toxin professional, coming out. She's fantastic. We talked a lot about environmental toxins, phylates, obesity, bpas a lot of stuff that really gets pushed aside when it comes to obesity and insulin resistance. I don't know if you know this this is a random side note, sorry but I think Dr Bickman is actually doing a study on pollution right now and instance. Yeah, I'll have to ask, but anyway, yeah, podcast, tons of stuff coming out Awesome.
Speaker 1:Those all sound very, very exciting. You do such a good job on your show and you've done such a good job here as our guest today. Thank you so very much for all of your work, everything that you've learned, and thank you for being willing to share your story and teach other people. It's been a pleasure to talk to you and we really really appreciate you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you, kc, it was an honor to be on.
Speaker 1:It was an honor to host you and this has been another episode of Balanced Body Radio. As always, thank you so very much for listening to Balanced Body Radio. I know I say this all the time, but I really do mean it. It has been such a joy to make and produce this podcast and to watch it grow. Our business started in the pandemic in July of 2020 and we started the podcast in October of 2020. So it has been three years now and to see that we have generated over 400,000 downloads worldwide is just simply unbelievable to me.
Speaker 1:This year in particular has been such a blast to travel to different health conferences and not only meet some of our amazing guests, but also to meet many of you, our listeners and supporters. We really just can't thank you enough. As always, feel free to book a complimentary 30 minute session on our website, which is mybalancedbodycom. On our homepage, there is a book now button where you can find a time to speak with us about health, fitness, nutrition, whatever you like. We've loved chatting with people all over the world and many of you out there to bounce ideas off each other or to try to come up with plans to achieve specific goals, or even if it's just to reach out, to introduce yourselves. We would just love to meet you and connect with you there.
Speaker 1:Also, be sure to check out our YouTube channel if you would like to watch these full interviews and also the shorter interviews on more specific topics that are taken from these full interviews. We've gotten really good feedback over there. It's also a really fun way to interact with people who comment. We read and reply to every single YouTube comment we get, so head on over there. If you want to start a conversation and watch these videos as always if you haven't already, please leave us a five star rating and review on Apple. It really is the best way to make sure this podcast gets out there to more listeners. We've been able to keep Balmous Body Radio ad free for three years and really want to continue to do so, and so your five star ratings and reviews are the best way to support us at Balmous Body and support the podcast. Cheers, thanks again. So very much for listening to Balmous Body Radio.